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 Post subject: Animal's Goat and Stars for 06/24
PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2012 7:12 pm 
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All in all, good series! Not a bad game against Verlander. We hung in there.

STARTER: Correia. Rough start after first two batters, but he hung in there pretty good. Six innings. Six hits, a walk, and two earned runs. Calling this a good start!

LOSER: After the Bucs fought back valiently, Resop falters, takes the loss.

GOAT: Offensive guys were equally bad for the most part. Gotta give the goat to Resop. After the Bucs tied it up, he gave it back.

STAR #3: Wasn't much, but Pedro got one of only 5 hits off of Verlander, and scored one of the two Bucco runs.

STAR #2: Correia gave them six solid innings, departing down by just 2-0.

STAR #1: GJones is all the offense the Bucs would muster...a two run HR.

HM: to Alex Presley, who led off the game with a nice bunt single and later walked..the only Pirate to get on base twice.

STANDINGS
Cutch 62
Burnett 50.5
McDonald 49.5
Alvarez 46
Walker 37
Tabata 32
Presley 26.5
Barajas 26
Harrison 25
GJones 24.5
Bedard 23.5
Correia 22
Lincoln 19
Barmes 17.5
McGehee 17.5
Hanrahan 17
Watson 14.5
Grilli 13
Hughes 12.75
Cruz 11.75
McHenry 10
Hague 10
Morton 4.5
Karstens 4.0
Meek 3.25
Slaten 3
Navarro 3.0
Resop 2.75
McLouth 2.5
Hernandez 1.0
Mercer 0.5

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 Post subject: Re: Animal's Goat and Stars for 06/24
PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2012 7:16 pm 
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Resop is the goat. Not because he gave up the winning run, but because he walked the guy ended being the winning run. Can't be giving stuff away. If the guy hits a HR, tip your hat to him.

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 Post subject: Re: Animal's Goat and Stars for 06/24
PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2012 8:10 pm 
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When are they going to figure out that resop cannot go multiple innings? :? :? :? :?


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 Post subject: Re: Animal's Goat and Stars for 06/24
PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2012 8:12 pm 
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When they have someone else who is available to pitch. That was not today.

Hey, Resop made an out pitch to end the inning, and Delmon just poked it through the whole instead of his usual popup.

ZM

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 Post subject: Re: Animal's Goat and Stars for 06/24
PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2012 10:11 pm 
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ZelieMike wrote:
Hey, Resop made an out pitch to end the inning, and Delmon just poked it through the whole instead of his usual popup.

ZM

Mike, he threw the first pitch to Young belt-high, middle. Young fouled it off. I told son, "He got away with one."

He thew another fastball belt-high, middle and Young singled to RF.

Terrible pitches. If he misses down, no harm. It is what it is.


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 Post subject: Re: Animal's Goat and Stars for 06/24
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 9:37 am 
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If no one had ever invented the "save", wouldn't Hanrahan have pitched the 8th?

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 Post subject: Re: Animal's Goat and Stars for 06/24
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 3:49 pm 
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SUPERCHARGED APE wrote:
If no one had ever invented the "save", wouldn't Hanrahan have pitched the 8th?


Has nothing to do with the invention of the save, but with how managers now perceive the "closer". Tekulve, and Guisti before him, routinely pitched more than one innig to get a save.

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 Post subject: Re: Animal's Goat and Stars for 06/24
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 4:25 pm 
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Animal wrote:
SUPERCHARGED APE wrote:
If no one had ever invented the "save", wouldn't Hanrahan have pitched the 8th?


Has nothing to do with the invention of the save, but with how managers now perceive the "closer". Tekulve, and Guisti before him, routinely pitched more than one innig to get a save.



He doesn't have to pitch the ninth. I'd just think with the Tigers 2-3-4 hitters coming up, you'd use your best option to get through that inning and use a lesser option in the ninth.

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 Post subject: Re: Animal's Goat and Stars for 06/24
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 5:16 pm 
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Az Bucco fan wrote:
When are they going to figure out that resop cannot go multiple innings? :? :? :? :?

I was surprised they kept him in there myself. Grill pitched an inning on Saturday, highly effective 12/16 strikes. He pitched an inning on Friday night 11-12 strikes. If they were worried he pitched on each of those days, then why even throw him Friday night when you are ahead 4-1. Bring a Resop in then and save an arm. Now granted he didn't throw on Thursday when JMac went the distance, but when you are tied 2-2 heading into the eighth inning, you bring in the guy who in reality is the best pitcher they have had all season coming out of the pen. There is no explanation for it, especially when they knew at that point they had the opportunity to pull into a tie for first place, since the Reds lost.
Goat stars should go to Banister for not using him, regardless if he wasn't available or not. This crap of pitching here and not pitching there is horrible and will lose a few games for us, just like yesterday if it continues.
We might be able to look back at this game down the stretch and say, I wished Grilli was in to hold that game.


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 Post subject: Re: Animal's Goat and Stars for 06/24
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 5:43 pm 
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johnswahoo wrote:
I was surprised they kept him in there myself. Grill pitched an inning on Saturday, highly effective 12/16 strikes. He pitched an inning on Friday night 11-12 strikes. If they were worried he pitched on each of those days, then why even throw him Friday night when you are ahead 4-1. Bring a Resop in then and save an arm. Now granted he didn't throw on Thursday when JMac went the distance, but when you are tied 2-2 heading into the eighth inning, you bring in the guy who in reality is the best pitcher they have had all season coming out of the pen. There is no explanation for it, especially when they knew at that point they had the opportunity to pull into a tie for first place, since the Reds lost.
Goat stars should go to Banister for not using him, regardless if he wasn't available or not. This crap of pitching here and not pitching there is horrible and will lose a few games for us, just like yesterday if it continues.
We might be able to look back at this game down the stretch and say, I wished Grilli was in to hold that game.


What's the old adage about losing the battle but winning the war?

With all due respect to Johnswahoo, this smacks of "crystal ball" analysis. If the Bucs are up 4-1 on Friday night and you have the chance to bring in Grilli to hold a lead, you do it. 100 times out of 100. Let's not lose sight of the fact that Lincoln was pitching on Saturday and you may not need Grilli on Saturday. You also have Correia on tap against Verlander on Sunday; you may also not need Grilli in that game. Friday night is a no brainer; you bring in your best "hold" guy in an effort to ensure best chance of victory.

As for yesterday . . . Hurdle has a "no pitching three days in a row" rule. Just because the Pirates had a chance to move into a tie for first place 71 games into the season is not, IMO, a good reason to abandon that rule. Pulling into a tie with 91 games left to play is, IMO, rather meaningless in the big picture. I don't mean to discount any particular game but . . . having Grilli's arm healthy for an entire season trumps any need to bring him into yesterday's game. I'm not a Resop fan; haven't been one for a while. But for a short bullpen, I'm sure that we would have seen Hughes in the 8th. If anything, I might have been tempted to see what Morris had to offer in light of the fact that the Tigers hitters haven't likely seen him before. But . . . I'm not going to be overly critical of trying to get another inning out of Resop.

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 Post subject: Re: Animal's Goat and Stars for 06/24
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 7:50 pm 
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it is all in retrospect and yes somewhat crystal ball thinking, but I do think you play game by game and worry about tomorrow. To me, using that theory you don't have a three day rule. Perhaps I'm old school in thinking that you have guys like this who should be able to day in and day out. I don't think 28 pitches in the previous two days was too much considering the circumstances.
I just heard that Hughes was not available, so hold Grilli was a good option because if this game goes into extra innings then you will need him considering that you have a limited bullpen to begin with.
I would like to see the Pirates pick up another guy who could come in during the 7th or 8th inning and hold down the game, considering our teams tends to play tight games.
But your point was well taken.


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