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 Post subject: Re: May 15, 2012 Pirates (17-18) at Marlins (18-17)
PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 11:05 am 
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sisyphus wrote:
rellimie wrote:
IA Pirate wrote:
That might be the swan song for Correia in the rotation.


Based on what? A bad start?

Based on the fact that he gives up too many hits, too many walks, and cannot make hitters swing and miss. Try making a list of all the pitchers you can find who put up ERAs under 4.00 while striking out 3.2 batters per nine innings, which was Correia's rate before it dropped even lower tonight. It's going to be a godawful short list, I assure you. He makes Zach Duke look like Nolan Ryan. This is the third year in a row that his K rate has dropped. I'd say he's finished as a major league starter. Put Lincoln in the rotation and let Corriea mop up out of the bullpen if you can't find anybody stupid enough to take him in a trade.


This.

Please, no more Correia. If not Lincoln, then Locke or Owens.

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 Post subject: Re: May 15, 2012 Pirates (17-18) at Marlins (18-17)
PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 11:13 am 
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I'd love to see Jeff Locke get a legit shot.

I think Correia is good to have for backup, but I'm tired of him as a starter. He's painfully average even when he does pitch well, and it strikes me more as him getting lucky or the opposing offense having a bad night, than him being that effective as a starter.


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 Post subject: Re: May 15, 2012 Pirates (17-18) at Marlins (18-17)
PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 12:30 pm 
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IA Pirate wrote:
rellimie wrote:
He's a 5th starter for crying out loud.


If the Pirates can improve by taking him out of the rotation (and possibly strengthen the bullpen in doing so) then I don't see the problem.


Taking him out because their is a better pitcher available is one thing. And I do agree that Karstens and Lincoln are better. However, I disagree with the opinion that he has been awful this year. He hasn't been. He's kept us in games for most of his starts.


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 Post subject: Re: May 15, 2012 Pirates (17-18) at Marlins (18-17)
PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 12:44 pm 
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rellimie wrote:
IA Pirate wrote:
rellimie wrote:
He's a 5th starter for crying out loud.


If the Pirates can improve by taking him out of the rotation (and possibly strengthen the bullpen in doing so) then I don't see the problem.


Taking him out because their is a better pitcher available is one thing. And I do agree that Karstens and Lincoln are better. However, I disagree with the opinion that he has been awful this year. He hasn't been. He's kept us in games for most of his starts.

Yes, because he has a good defense playing behind him and, likely, a shamrock shoved up is ass. Pitchers who strikeout hitters at a rate below 4 K/9 are almost entirely dependent upon their defense to win games. Such is the case for Correia, who has been relying almost exclusively on the Pirates' good fielding defense, particularly in the outfield, to keep runners off the basepaths.

Another thing to note: the quality starts he's had thus far have been against below-average offenses, and we can't expect that to continue. Correia is very fortunate to have an ERA as low as he has.

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 Post subject: Re: May 15, 2012 Pirates (17-18) at Marlins (18-17)
PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 1:49 pm 
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Correia reminds me of a right handed Zach Duke...

He might make a good long guy/spot starter out of the bullpen but that's about it. He was a needed piece last year but the pitching in the minors has started started to show they are ready for a chance at the Major League level.

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 Post subject: Re: May 15, 2012 Pirates (17-18) at Marlins (18-17)
PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 3:05 pm 
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Barrys Dopers wrote:
This.

Please, no more Correia. If not Lincoln, then Locke or Owens.


But... But... He was an all star! :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: May 15, 2012 Pirates (17-18) at Marlins (18-17)
PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 3:51 pm 
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Corriea has been in games for the most part. Aside from his last couple starts he's been pretty consistent. Keep in mind he's had little to no run support. As a matter of fact the entire starting staff hasn't had much run support. Corriea isn't going to overpower anyone. If I recall correctly he used to be more of a strikeout pitcher than pitch to contact guy when he first came into the league. Of course back then he was throwing with much more velocity. It appears to me he still has the offspead pitches to get by. Aside from the first inning yesterday where he couldn't locate the plate I thought he did a great job of pitching. Give credit to the Marlins for finding holes. The Pirate hitters could learn a thing or two about that. Keeping innings alive offensively is something this offense couldn't do against the weakest pitchers in the league.

Having said that I would still like to see younger guys be given a fair chance, afterall, everybody wants to see that. There are some guys going good, Lincoln, Owens, Locke and Smith before he was injured.


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 Post subject: Re: May 15, 2012 Pirates (17-18) at Marlins (18-17)
PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 7:18 pm 
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rellimie wrote:
I only care about him going at least 6 innings and giving up 3 or less runs. Which he has done 4 out of 7 starts. What do I care how many hits and walks he gives up if he doesn't give up the runs. He's a 5th starter for crying out loud.

The point is that he CANNOT continue to give up 3 or less in six inning without some semblance of control and five strikeouts per nine innings at the very minimum. And if you think that 4 quality starts in 7 tries is good, well, let's just say that we have different standards. Sure, he's a fifth starter. We have one guy on the roster, one on the DL, and several at AAA who I think would be better fifth starters than Correia is.

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 Post subject: Re: May 15, 2012 Pirates (17-18) at Marlins (18-17)
PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 7:20 pm 
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I think the plan is to showcase him, hope he has enough good outings to impress someone enough to take on the rest of the salary and send the pirates a new bat rack for the cages. 8-) 8-) 8-)


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 Post subject: Re: May 15, 2012 Pirates (17-18) at Marlins (18-17)
PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 8:02 pm 
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Az Bucco fan wrote:
I think the plan is to showcase him, hope he has enough good outings to impress someone enough to take on the rest of the salary and send the pirates a new bat rack for the cages. 8-) 8-) 8-)

If that's the plan, Correia will ensure that its counterproductive.

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