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 Post subject: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 8:04 pm 
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Maholm vs. Volquez

Pirates

Mc Louth - cf
Sanchez - 2b
Bay - lf
Doumit - c
La Roche - 1b
Mientkiewicz - rf
Bautista - 3b
Duke - p
Wilson - ss


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 Post subject: Re: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 8:22 pm 
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Of course I meant Duke vs. Maholm. Hopefully Zach will finally even his record at 5-5.

What do you guys think about the pitchers hitting 8th? I thought it was cool when the Cardinals & Brewers did it, but now that we're doing it I just feel it's stupid. I'd rather just hit Jack second. He's one of our better hitters this year. Makes no sense to move the pitchers up in the order unless we have Rick Rhoden or Don Robinson pitching and we don't.

I'm just not feeling it for John Russell these days. Is this an innovative move on his part? Why can't he do something really creative like allowing some aggressive baserunning? I think the guys like playing for him and it's nice how he uses his bench but I want more.


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 Post subject: Re: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 8:25 pm 
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Aaargh.. Duke vs. Volquez I meant. Aww screw it, I'll just listen to Brad Lincoln's game on the Big Dog. He retired the first five batters so far. Bobby Spain has a wrist fracture.


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 Post subject: Re: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 8:52 pm 
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Ollie wrote:
Of course I meant Duke vs. Maholm. Hopefully Zach will finally even his record at 5-5.

What do you guys think about the pitchers hitting 8th? I thought it was cool when the Cardinals & Brewers did it, but now that we're doing it I just feel it's stupid. I'd rather just hit Jack second. He's one of our better hitters this year. Makes no sense to move the pitchers up in the order unless we have Rick Rhoden or Don Robinson pitching and we don't.

I'm just not feeling it for John Russell these days. Is this an innovative move on his part? Why can't he do something really creative like allowing some aggressive baserunning? I think the guys like playing for him and it's nice how he uses his bench but I want more.


I like Russell so far but...I thought this was a stupid way to over analyze the game when LaRussa(aka "The Genius") first did it. I don't care how great of a baseball mind you are it is nearly impossible to predict each game how the lineup will turnover. So you play the odds. Well, in most of these cases the guy you move to the ninth hole would have hit eighth. The reasoning I've heard from managers on this is that it provides them with a sort of second leadoff man when the lineup comes around. What? If it is a guy who would have hit eighth then that is your worst hitting regular. How is that providing a second leadoff man??? Sure it improves the odds from the pitcher hitting there but c'mon?? And Ollie I agree if Wilson is supposed to provide another table setter for the middle of the lineup then just hit him second. To me all this move does is get the pitcher to the plate one batter earlier than you want him there. I think this is a stupid idea!


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 Post subject: Re: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 9:24 pm 
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I think it's incredibly stupid. I cannot think of a single reason that putting the pitcher in the 8th spot would be advantageous.

Last night, Kent Tekulve gave a somewhat logical reason why the Cards started doing it. At the time, Pujols was their only RBI man, so if he's in the three spot, the 9th guy may bat, get on base, and hopefully be on third when Pujols hits. I s'pose that makes sense, but batting Pujols fourth is what one *should* do.

I'm not anti-tradition. Perfect example - the infield shift. Unorthodox, but it has a purpose.

You bat the pitcher ninth, to ensure he gets less plate appearances than the regular hitters! I s'pose then, maybe it would make sense to bat Ken Brett, Don Robinson, Rick Reuschel eighth -- they can hit a bit. I would be tempted to bat Kemer Brett ahead of Dale Berra or Jackie Hernandez, for example. But that's different - a pitcher who can hit and a shortstop who cannot.

Rambling over.

Jay


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 Post subject: Re: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 10:06 pm 
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Don't look now, but LaRoche has just matched his highest BA of the season tonight -- .236. Interestingly (to me at least) he got it up to that the first time also vs. Cincinnati, back on May 27. The next day he went into another tailspin from which he's only now apparently emerging.

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 Post subject: Re: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 10:14 pm 
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If Russell is interested in getting more guys on base in front of the heart of the order, here is a simple solution...

...drop Sanchez down to 8th in the order. Problem solved.


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 Post subject: Re: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 10:56 pm 
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Sigh. Here we go again. Thanks, Damaso -- not.

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 Post subject: Re: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 10:57 pm 
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Our bullpen is officially starting to suck.

Marte was awful last night too.

This series could be the beginning of the end.

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 Post subject: Re: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 11:00 pm 
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I stayed up for the whole game last night. Not gonna do it again. They'll have to blow it without me.

%#$& team just can't stand prosperity. I have to wonder whether they truly want to break .500.

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 Post subject: Re: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 11:03 pm 
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What the hell happened. When I left the bar we were ahead 3-1. Got home and we're tied. Couldn't be Capps this time 8th inning.

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 Post subject: Re: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 11:04 pm 
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Well at least Capps won't blow a save tonight.

As for Duke hitting 8th in the order, it hurt us tonight! With two out in the 2nd inning and a runner on 2nd base the Reds walked Bautista to get to Duke. Duke struck out. Then in the top of the 6th we had two runners in scoring position with two out and up steps the # 8 hitter. You guessed it, Duke struck out again.

We don't need to put more pressure on our pitchers. This is bull crap. Zach was probably thinking "this sorry a$$ team won't score any runs for me and now they want me to drive in runs for myself?" This manager blows..


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 Post subject: Re: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 11:05 pm 
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Our baserunning has been horrible this game. How Gomez didn't get to second on Jack's bunt is mind boggling.

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 Post subject: Re: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 11:07 pm 
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And now Jack gets caught stealing in the ninth inning of a tied game.

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 Post subject: Re: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 11:22 pm 
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Can anyone tell me why Doumit didn't score on the double by LaRoche. Did he tag up instead of going half way? It should have been an easy score. Yes, I know he scored anyway but why not when he should have?

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2011 Will Be Our Year -- well make that 2012 (just saying) So it looks like 2013 now - how long must this go on!
THIS IS IT-- NO MORE STREAK!!! *** Finally*** Time to win it in 2014


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 Post subject: Re: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 11:25 pm 
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The announcers said he was heading back to the bag which was an awful read by Doumit. Like I said before, awful baserunning night for the Bucs.

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 Post subject: Re: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 11:29 pm 
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Michaels comes through tonight.

I am not sure I even can watch the bottom of the tenth.

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 Post subject: Re: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 11:30 pm 
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Any team that IBBs Laroche deserves to suffer for it.

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 Post subject: Re: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 11:36 pm 
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Two blown saves tonight. Three in the past two nights.

:shock:

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 Post subject: Re: 7-1-08 Pirates at Cincinnati Reds
PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 11:43 pm 
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What do you think? Can we get a third blown save tonight?

I think we can.

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