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 Post subject: July rotation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 3:30 pm 
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I'm hoping it's

AJ
Wandy
Liriano
Cole
Karstens.

If Karstens doesn't have his command, we would still have Locke/MacDonald. In that rotation, you have a lot of contrast, a good mix of lefties and righties, power, finesse, etc.


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 Post subject: Re: July rotation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 3:33 pm 
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I'm hoping for Morton over Karstens. But at least we have a chance for a good rotation.


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 Post subject: Re: July rotation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 3:44 pm 
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I'd love to see Taillon make the jump to the Majors in August. He dominated AA in his first three starts last year and has picked up right where he left off with his first three starts this year. Plus, he had a nice outing in The World Baseball Classic.

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 Post subject: Re: July rotation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 3:50 pm 
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I second Taillon getting called up if he continues to dominate. Start the guys clock. Hope Morton will be back to what he was in 2011. Maybe make some moves at the deadline with the depth this club is developing.


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 Post subject: Re: July rotation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 4:33 pm 
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I'm with both of you guys on Taillon. If this is supposedly a year you have a chance to compete, then bring him up if you think he's ready.

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 Post subject: Re: July rotation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 5:11 pm 
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Ralphie wrote:
I'm hoping for Morton over Karstens. But at least we have a chance for a good rotation.



I agree.

It's easy to forget how dominate Charlie was for a while. Maybe he can find that again and bring that wicked stuff back.


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 Post subject: Re: July rotation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 5:25 pm 
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VanSlick wrote:
It's easy to forget how dominate Charlie was for a while. Maybe he can find that again and bring that wicked stuff back.


I wouldn't say it's easy to forget since when he's on his stuff looks un-hittable, it's more that it has never been sustainable for more than a couple of months at a time. Even in 2011, his only full healthy season when he was the most successful, he had a dominant start to the season but was awful in June/July and then was mediocre the last two months.

I'm not even the biggest Karstens fan myself but I'm surprised people would actually prefer Morton over him at this point. Always rooted for Morton given the raw talent that was there, but he was on my non-tender list in the offseason. Not giving up on a turnaround but after all the injuries I'm not very optimistic.


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 Post subject: Re: July rotation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 7:40 pm 
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Re: Morton

We all know he can sport filthy stuff, but is prone to 'collapses' when 'overexposed'. Might the 'pen be the best spot for him? Think Brad Lincoln last year or a [really] poor man's Aroldis Chapman. Having Chaz as an option to start will be nice, but getting the most out of him will be most imporant.

Re: Cole/Taillon

June 5-10 is when the arb clock date passes, right? So if the Bucs call one of them up at that time then they still start his 6-year clock, but gain a year of rule 5/arb status, or...? Someone please remind me of the specific date(s) to keep track of.

Re: Overall rotation

Whatever can give JMac a break will be nice. Liriano and Derp obviously have injury concerns, too, but getting JMac healthy (mentally and physicall) and back into 2012 pre-AS break form, if possible, would be HUGE.

It's nice that the Pirates will have (a bevy of) options.

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 Post subject: Re: July rotation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 7:52 pm 
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Burnett
Wandy:
McDonald
Karstens
Cole

I wrote Morton off my list last year, two many meltdowns, can't stay healthy, head case.

I think J Mac will go on the DL with whatever is bothering him and come back stronger.

Karstens, I still see as this era's Bob Walk. Forgotten, overlooked, let go, and then he's starting game #1 of the post season.


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 Post subject: Re: July rotation
PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2013 11:07 am 
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NSMaster56 wrote:
Re: Morton

We all know he can sport filthy stuff, but is prone to 'collapses' when 'overexposed'. Might the 'pen be the best spot for him? Think Brad Lincoln last year or a [really] poor man's Aroldis Chapman. Having Chaz as an option to start will be nice, but getting the most out of him will be most imporant.

Re: Cole/Taillon

June 5-10 is when the arb clock date passes, right? So if the Bucs call one of them up at that time then they still start his 6-year clock, but gain a year of rule 5/arb status, or...? Someone please remind me of the specific date(s) to keep track of.

Re: Overall rotation

Whatever can give JMac a break will be nice. Liriano and Derp obviously have injury concerns, too, but getting JMac healthy (mentally and physicall) and back into 2012 pre-AS break form, if possible, would be HUGE.

It's nice that the Pirates will have (a bevy of) options.


The June cutoff is floating based on the service time of all rookies in a given year. Its the top 22% of players with 2 years of service but not 3 years that qualify for an extra 4th year of arbitration (Super 2). Last year it was 139 days of service so the cut date turned out to be around June 10th. There is no way to know for sure since it will not be determined until 2015. Teams base the decision on historical data that suggest somewhere around 140 days. All this date controls is if a player gets 3 or 4 years of arbitration salary, it has no bearing on free agency/team control. Basically, if you call up Cole now he starts making millions during the 2016 season and it escalates through 2019. If you wait until mid-June you likely delay him from making big money until 2017 through 2019.

The 6 full years for free agency deadline is already passed. You could call up Cole today and this year won't count as a full season (172 days), he is a Pirate until 2019 regardless of when you call him up this year.

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 Post subject: Re: July rotation
PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2013 12:09 pm 
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A.J. Burnett
Wandy Rodriguez
Gerrit Cole
Francisco Liriano
Charlie Morton

I believe McDonald is hurt and won't pitch after May. I believe Karstens is hurt pretty badly and will only be available for long relief. I believe Jonathan Sanchez sucks. I believe Jeff Locke pitches scared in the bigs and should be, at best, starter #6.


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 Post subject: Re: July rotation
PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2013 1:07 pm 
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NSMaster56 wrote:
Re: Morton

We all know he can sport filthy stuff, but is prone to 'collapses' when 'overexposed'. Might the 'pen be the best spot for him? Think Brad Lincoln last year or a [really] poor man's Aroldis Chapman. Having Chaz as an option to start will be nice, but getting the most out of him will be most imporant.


If Morton's hitting 96 on the gun like I saw in another thread, him and Justin Wilson would be bringing some heat out of the pen if he ended up there.


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 Post subject: Re: July rotation
PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2013 2:54 pm 
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If that's spotting 96 on a sinking fastball, I'm all in. It was always command with Morton. Remember when Morton came over from the braves he pitched over the top unlike the 3/4 delivery he has now.


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 Post subject: Re: July rotation
PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2013 8:13 pm 
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Barrys Dopers wrote:
*Explanation of roster clocks*


Thanks!

I always get the 6 year and Arb clocks mixed up for some reason.

Based upon the usual line of thinking ('Cheap Nuttings') the fans will probably have to wait until after the June cutoff to see Cole/Taillon.

[Unfortunately] Agree with those who think JMac is injured and may not see many more starts after May/June.

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